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manchowder1
(@manchowder1)
New Member
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 3
Topic starter  

A couple questions on the contest:

1. It says that a writer cannot have more than 3 pro publications (pro being 6 cents per word or more) to enter. However, can you submit a story that was previously published in a semi pro market? (1 cent per word?) (or even a pro market - not that I have any :))

2. The contest rules mention no song lyrics. Im assuming this is exact quotes, but can song lyrics be referenced, IE 'Shinedown dared me to...'

Thanks!


   
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amoskalik
(@amoskalik)
Reputable Member
Joined: 3 years ago
Posts: 438
 

1. No, they want only unpublished stories to be entered. That also means you should not submit a story that you self-published or posted to your website, blog, etc. The rule you are referencing is regarding author eligibility. If you publish four or more short stories in pro markets, then you have pro'd out of the contest (always best to check with Joni first when this happens as there is some gray area on this one).

2. Publishing stories with song lyrics creates tricky copyright issues that they wish to avoid. Not just this contest, but most publishers find this a headache they can do without,so if you include lyrics in your story, be aware that you are limiting your prospects. Referring to them obliquely, as opposed to straight up quoting them, is probably less troublesome, but I'm no expert and can't say for sure. Perhaps someone else can comment on that.


   
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kentagions
(@kentagions)
Trusted Member
Joined: 8 years ago
Posts: 94
 

Hi manchowder1,
Rule #3 states the answer to both questions:

All entries must be original works by the entrant, in English. Plagiarism, which includes the use of third-party poetry, song lyrics, characters or another person’s universe, without written permission, will result in disqualification. Excessive violence or sex, determined by the judges, will result in disqualification. Entries may not have been previously published in professional media.

Professional publication includes any remuneration of any kind for publication (Money in any amount, copies, stock options, toaster or a lifetime supply of gum.).

Plagiarism: If you were to say that a character was humming McCartney and Lennon's Yesterday, or simply used the song title in italics, that is okay. Using someone else's lines, lyrics, text, video or pictures in a work - whether intended for resale or not - (Without express, written permission) constitutes the legal tort of plagiarism. Even similar sounding lyrics can be called into question. I do not work for WotF, but I can assure you that all members of the staff will protect the contest from any perceived legal threat. Nobody in the industry takes a chance with any ambiguity.

Sorry if my post is perceived as unduly harsh. Plagiarism is the unpardonable sin. Don't go near it.

Good luck,
Kent


   
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manchowder1
(@manchowder1)
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Joined: 5 years ago
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Topic starter  

thanks for the response! I'll err on the side of careful Smile


   
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Katie
(@katie)
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Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 2
 

Can the story be more than 17000 words?


   
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Dustin Adams
(@axeminister)
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Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 1077
 

Can the story be more than 17000 words?

Nope.
Nor can it be over 68 pages of courier new 12 pt 1.5" margins.
(someone correct me if I'm wrong on the #s)

Reason: 250 words per page (printed) x 68 = 17000

2x Finalist
2x Semi
8x Silver
10x HM
Finalist #2 Read it here!


   
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PhoenixHays
(@phoenixhays)
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So I was racing against the clock last night to upload my entry to the contest...

1. How do I know that the submission went in for the quarter ending March 31? I couldn't find submission cutoff times (eastern v pacific).

2. I woke up in the middle of the night realizing that I didn't double space the story. Will they kick the story out of the contest for that?

Thanks in advance for the help. This is my first attempt to enter this contest.

-Phoenix Hays


   
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jficke13
(@jficke13)
Trusted Member
Joined: 6 years ago
Posts: 80
 

So I was racing against the clock last night to upload my entry to the contest...

1. How do I know that the submission went in for the quarter ending March 31? I couldn't find submission cutoff times (eastern v pacific).

2. I woke up in the middle of the night realizing that I didn't double space the story. Will they kick the story out of the contest for that?

Thanks in advance for the help. This is my first attempt to enter this contest.

-Phoenix Hays

1. I'm like 99.9% positive they key of Pacific time. They are based in LA. You could always email Joni and ask, but she's probably pretty busy with the conference starting in a couple days so you might not get a quick answer.

2. Probably not. This is a market designed for new people, so it's possible that Dave gives a longer leash to things like that. There are markets where it would be an auto-reject, though, so maybe treat this as a good reminder that "read the submission guidelines" is a super important part of being a serious writer.

HM x2, Vol. 34 Q4 - 3rd. http://www.jonficke.com


   
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YM Pang
(@ym-pang)
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Posts: 50
 

1. It's Pacific Time. In Q1 the portal closed and I emailed Joni with my entry after it was past midnight in Eastern Time. She accepted it. I felt like a jerk and wouldn't recommend doing what I did, but Pacific Time is the cut-off.

2. Not sure. But I assume with electronic subs, it's a little less annoying (possible to reformat and stuff), so hopefully it won't be instant DQ. A print submission single-spaced probably won't make a good impression.

Michelle Pang
http://www.ympang.com
1xFinalist, 10xHM

"Subtle Ways Each Time" in Escape Pod.
"The Palace of the Silver Dragon" in Strange Horizons.


   
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kentagions
(@kentagions)
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Joined: 8 years ago
Posts: 94
 

Hi PhoenixHays,

Rule #6, sentence 4 states:

Entries submitted electronically must be double-spaced and must include the title and page number on each page, but not the author’s name.

So, I have a different opinion on your entry's chances. On the bright side (if indeed it is rejected in the first pass), you will know exactly why it has been rejected. That's more than I've ever learned about my Rs and HMs.

Good luck,
Kent


   
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amoskalik
(@amoskalik)
Reputable Member
Joined: 3 years ago
Posts: 438
 

Can the story be more than 17000 words?

Nope.
Nor can it be over 68 pages of courier new 12 pt 1.5" margins.
(someone correct me if I'm wrong on the #s)

Reason: 250 words per page (printed) x 68 = 17000

The exacting format page count used to be the correct answer, but my understanding is DF relented recently and joined the 21st century in using the word processor word count.


   
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cfkreitzer@gmail.com
(@cfkreitzergmail-com)
New Member
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 1
 

1Is there a date those who entered should expect to hear something back by? I can't find this information anywhere. I'm assuming before the next quarterly contest but that feels torturously far away.
2Also does anyone know if the rejects get any feed back on their piece? Or is it just a no.
3Do they get notified in order of being rejected so we can at least try and tell ourselves that it taking a while could be a good sign? Smile


   
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RETreasure
(@rschibler)
Prominent Member
Joined: 6 years ago
Posts: 902
 

1. Response times vary, you can browse old threads to get an idea. Q1 results will probably be out before the end of April. For Q2 I believe I heard in May last year. Maybe June? Just checked it was July 9, in the second wave because I submitted on paper. Long waits!
2. Semi finalists get feedback. The contest has many many entries so only those few get personalized feedback. I recommend swapping with people to get good feedback on your work!
3. You will absolutely be notified. Results tend to come on waves- a wave of initial rejections and then a second wave with the finalists being notified and the other tiers as well with a smattering of rejections, and then the final notification of the winners.

Hang in there!

V34: R,HM,R
V35: HM,R,R,HM
V36: R,HM,HM,SHM
V37: HM,SF,SHM,SHM
V38: (P)F, SHM, F, F
V39: SHM, SHM, P, P
Always Available for 5-page Critiques
CV & Editing Services: www.rebeccaetreasure.com
Reviews & Short Stories: www.patreon.com/rebeccaetreasure


   
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Disgruntled Peony
(@disgruntledpeony)
Mother of Dragons
Joined: 3 years ago
Posts: 1282
 

Every once in awhile, the first and second wave happen in one go. If it's going to happen, Q1 is the quarter I'd bet on.

If you are in difficulties with a book, try the element of surprise: attack it at an hour when it isn't expecting it. ~ H.G. Wells
If a person offend you, and you are in doubt as to whether it was intentional or not, do not resort to extreme measures; simply watch your chance and hit him with a brick. ~ Mark Twain
R, SF, SHM, SHM, SHM, F, R, HM, SHM, R, HM, R, F, SHM, SHM, SHM, SF, SHM, 1st Place (Q2 V38)
Ticknor Tales
Twitter
4th and Starlight: e-book | paperback


   
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kentagions
(@kentagions)
Trusted Member
Joined: 8 years ago
Posts: 94
 

I look for results at three and a half months. *Twitch*

If they're not in by three and a half months, I figure I've made the first pass. *Twitch, twitch*

When results come in on the Forum, but not mine, I... *Twitch, twitch, twitch. Hide under covers while poking Refresh*

When finalists announce on the Forum, I check to see if my phone is charged, that I'm using the right email, and reread my story for the eighty-ninth time. And I hope nobody sees that glaring typo on page three or that dialog that doesn't seem to fit this time on page twenty-two.

Finally, after results are all in except mine (Yes, this happened), I wrote a kind query to Joni, asking what may have happened to my entry. She wrote back with condolences and to ask if I would like to see the current tips on writing. I accepted the tips and stopped twitching.


   
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AmytheAuthor
(@amytheauthor)
Active Member
Joined: 5 years ago
Posts: 8
 

Question asked from newbie Jason on the intro thread I'm also wondering...

Do they offer a critique for our entries?

Thanks!

Constantly writing in my mind, rarely getting it typed up.
Q1 35: R Q3 35: . wotf052


   
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Morgan
(@morgan-broadhead)
Reputable Member
Joined: 10 years ago
Posts: 289
 

Question asked from newbie Jason on the intro thread I'm also wondering...

Do they offer a critique for our entries?

Thanks!

My understanding is they only provide critiques for semi-finalist entries and above. But I don't really know for sure because my entries have not reached above HM yet...YET! lol

~Morgan

"Writers WRITE. And they finish what they start."
— Chuck Wendig
Drop me a line at https://morganbroadhead.com
SFx1
HMx1
Rx4


   
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Dustin Adams
(@axeminister)
Noble Member
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 1077
 

Critiques are for semi-finalists - ONLY.
So, eight (8) stories per quarter.

2x Finalist
2x Semi
8x Silver
10x HM
Finalist #2 Read it here!


   
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Wulf Moon
(@wulfmoon)
Member
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 2831
 

Can the story be more than 17000 words?

Nope.
Nor can it be over 68 pages of courier new 12 pt 1.5" margins.
(someone correct me if I'm wrong on the #s)

Reason: 250 words per page (printed) x 68 = 17000

Just a friendly reminder: 17,000 on word count is the max you may submit. And it's actual word processor count now (YaY!), not publisher's word count, as described above. Dave weighed in on this change on my FB feed. You will see comments under the thread "Goodbye, Publisher's Word Count."

Hope that helps!

~Moon~

Click here to JOIN THE WULF PACK!
"Super-Duper Moongirl and the Amazing Moon Dawdler" won Best SFF Story of 2019! Read it in WotF, Volume 35. Order HERE!
"Muzik Man" won Best SFF Story of 2020! Read it in Best of Deep Magic Anthology Two!
You know WotF Workshop's 24-hour story exercise? Want to see what I wrote? Just awarded Best All Other Short Stories of 2021! Read in THINGS WITH FEATHERS. Order HERE!
Enjoy my award-winning SUPER SECRETS of Writing articles! FREE to read in every issue of DreamForge Anvil! Don't miss Best Positive Future Story of 2021: "Shaken, Not Stirred." FREE! Click HERE!


   
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Eagerink
(@eagerink)
Estimable Member
Joined: 3 years ago
Posts: 118
 

I have a question about pro markets and the contest -

I understand that a market is considered pro if it pays 6 cents a word or more, correct? But what if it only pays 6 cents up to a certain word count, and your story is longer than that? I'm guessing that still counts, but thought I'd ask Smile


   
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Disgruntled Peony
(@disgruntledpeony)
Mother of Dragons
Joined: 3 years ago
Posts: 1282
 

I have a question about pro markets and the contest -

I understand that a market is considered pro if it pays 6 cents a word or more, correct? But what if it only pays 6 cents up to a certain word count, and your story is longer than that? I'm guessing that still counts, but thought I'd ask Smile
In my experience, the best way to make sure a market is considered a pro market by contest standards is if it's an official SFWA qualifying market (you'll need to scroll down past the membership requirements, but there's a complete list at that link).

If you are in difficulties with a book, try the element of surprise: attack it at an hour when it isn't expecting it. ~ H.G. Wells
If a person offend you, and you are in doubt as to whether it was intentional or not, do not resort to extreme measures; simply watch your chance and hit him with a brick. ~ Mark Twain
R, SF, SHM, SHM, SHM, F, R, HM, SHM, R, HM, R, F, SHM, SHM, SHM, SF, SHM, 1st Place (Q2 V38)
Ticknor Tales
Twitter
4th and Starlight: e-book | paperback


   
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Eagerink
(@eagerink)
Estimable Member
Joined: 3 years ago
Posts: 118
 

I have a question about pro markets and the contest -

I understand that a market is considered pro if it pays 6 cents a word or more, correct? But what if it only pays 6 cents up to a certain word count, and your story is longer than that? I'm guessing that still counts, but thought I'd ask Smile
In my experience, the best way to make sure a market is considered a pro market by contest standards is if it's an official SFWA qualifying market (you'll need to scroll down past the membership requirements, but there's a complete list at that link).

Thank you! That is helpful. So if a magazine pays 6 cents a word, (e. g. Deep Magic) but it's not on that list WotF doesn't count it??? wotf021


   
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Disgruntled Peony
(@disgruntledpeony)
Mother of Dragons
Joined: 3 years ago
Posts: 1282
 

I have a question about pro markets and the contest -

I understand that a market is considered pro if it pays 6 cents a word or more, correct? But what if it only pays 6 cents up to a certain word count, and your story is longer than that? I'm guessing that still counts, but thought I'd ask Smile
In my experience, the best way to make sure a market is considered a pro market by contest standards is if it's an official SFWA qualifying market (you'll need to scroll down past the membership requirements, but there's a complete list at that link).

Thank you! That is helpful. So if a magazine pays 6 cents a word, (e. g. Deep Magic) but it's not on that list WotF doesn't count it??? wotf021

I reviewed the rules to be sure and, while it's not quite that cut and dried:

Professional publication is deemed to be payment of at least six cents per word, and at least 5,000 copies, or 5,000 hits.

If you are in difficulties with a book, try the element of surprise: attack it at an hour when it isn't expecting it. ~ H.G. Wells
If a person offend you, and you are in doubt as to whether it was intentional or not, do not resort to extreme measures; simply watch your chance and hit him with a brick. ~ Mark Twain
R, SF, SHM, SHM, SHM, F, R, HM, SHM, R, HM, R, F, SHM, SHM, SHM, SF, SHM, 1st Place (Q2 V38)
Ticknor Tales
Twitter
4th and Starlight: e-book | paperback


   
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Morgan
(@morgan-broadhead)
Reputable Member
Joined: 10 years ago
Posts: 289
 

When you find yourself in that position of wondering whether you're still eligible to enter the contest, you can always send a note to Joni and ask. Include the word count of the stories you've sold, who bought the stories, and how much they paid you. She'll let you know.

"Writers WRITE. And they finish what they start."
— Chuck Wendig
Drop me a line at https://morganbroadhead.com
SFx1
HMx1
Rx4


   
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jficke13
(@jficke13)
Trusted Member
Joined: 6 years ago
Posts: 80
 

When you find yourself in that position of wondering whether you're still eligible to enter the contest, you can always send a note to Joni and ask. Include the word count of the stories you've sold, who bought the stories, and how much they paid you. She'll let you know.

The, erm, perception is that inquiry is more likely than not to tip toward eligibility rather than ineligibility.

I think the contest wants good people submitting, so unless it's clear that you've pro-ed out, I suspect borderline cases stay in, but it's nothing I have personal experience with, so wotf017

HM x2, Vol. 34 Q4 - 3rd. http://www.jonficke.com


   
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Wulf Moon
(@wulfmoon)
Member
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 2831
 

I'll weigh in here as well. Deep Magic is not SFWA qualified. They are a great magazine, however, and are working toward that goal. They do pay pro rate, but they cap, and SFWA does not allow for that. They also do not meet the number of issues/hits requirement. Don't ask me how I know, but trust me on this. You are not disqualified if this is your fourth sale *and publication*, and your other three were pro sales that have also been published.

Hope that helps!

~Moon~

Click here to JOIN THE WULF PACK!
"Super-Duper Moongirl and the Amazing Moon Dawdler" won Best SFF Story of 2019! Read it in WotF, Volume 35. Order HERE!
"Muzik Man" won Best SFF Story of 2020! Read it in Best of Deep Magic Anthology Two!
You know WotF Workshop's 24-hour story exercise? Want to see what I wrote? Just awarded Best All Other Short Stories of 2021! Read in THINGS WITH FEATHERS. Order HERE!
Enjoy my award-winning SUPER SECRETS of Writing articles! FREE to read in every issue of DreamForge Anvil! Don't miss Best Positive Future Story of 2021: "Shaken, Not Stirred." FREE! Click HERE!


   
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Eagerink
(@eagerink)
Estimable Member
Joined: 3 years ago
Posts: 118
 

Okay great, thanks for for the help everyone!


   
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katt_kitt
(@katt_kitt)
New Member
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 2
 

Can the story be more than 17000 words?

Nope.
Nor can it be over 68 pages of courier new 12 pt 1.5" margins.
(someone correct me if I'm wrong on the #s)

Reason: 250 words per page (printed) x 68 = 17000

Just a friendly reminder: 17,000 on word count is the max you may submit. And it's actual word processor count now (YaY!), not publisher's word count, as described above. Dave weighed in on this change on my FB feed. You will see comments under the thread "Goodbye, Publisher's Word Count."

Hope that helps!

~Moon~

Can someone explain whats the difference between word processor count and publisher's word count? It's my first time to do something like this, and I usually write with PENCIL AND PAPER, haven't written anything that I like enough to type out.
Thanks Smile


   
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katt_kitt
(@katt_kitt)
New Member
Joined: 4 years ago
Posts: 2
 

Hi, so about the 17,000 word max, what are you supposed to do if your story is longer? I'm planning several stories, each being a hundred or so pages in length. Do I make the story shorter? Do I send in an "unfinished" version of the story?
Thanks


   
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RETreasure
(@rschibler)
Prominent Member
Joined: 6 years ago
Posts: 902
 

You should send in a complete story that fits the word count. If you don't have anything that is under 17k words, either edit them down (although the closer to that limit they are, they harder of a sell they're going to be), or write something that is Smile

V34: R,HM,R
V35: HM,R,R,HM
V36: R,HM,HM,SHM
V37: HM,SF,SHM,SHM
V38: (P)F, SHM, F, F
V39: SHM, SHM, P, P
Always Available for 5-page Critiques
CV & Editing Services: www.rebeccaetreasure.com
Reviews & Short Stories: www.patreon.com/rebeccaetreasure


   
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